Let's talk about communism!
Read the post I had Yesterday, I know it's Goofy but I'm Serious! Let us explore Community and how we are called to live it out. "If we divorce the people of God (church) from the Gospel, It ceases to be the Gospel. It's not just me and Jesus" (Derek Webb) The Gospel message is for Humanity, and not an individual call! I believe it is the calling of a people, Israel! It is the calling of community! I may have just stepped on some toes, so lets talk. Is the emphasis the American Church since the modern era on the individual? Was God's call to a people rather Just a person? I mean I know he called Abe and Moses, but wasn't that to something greater than an individual call? Maybe I am way of base, maybe I need to be brought back to Orthodoxy! Please help me Brothers!
JJ
JJ
posted by jamis4 at 2:49 PM
11 Comments:
I think your right about the call to community (of sorts). God called Abraham to be the father of many. God called Moses to lead HIS people into the Promised Land. With their individual calls came a responsibility to community life.
What sort of community? How are we called to live with each other? Is the individual focus in American Christianity a classical focus, or is it more cummunal? THese are questions I have been wrestling with, maybe you guys can help!
I think that the call to community is the election of Israel (the descendants of the promise of Abraham), as in Romans chapter 8, and Paul gets to how the community should live beginning in Romans chapter 12. I really think you're on to something important in the call and election of community. It seems that this is something important that the emergent church has brought up. A really good book on Christian community is "Life Together" by Dietrich Bonhoeffer. If you haven't already read it, it is really practical. I read it this summer, and it got me real fired up. I wish I were still really fired up.
Correction on my last post, its the end of Romans 8 and into Romans 9 - 11.
I had a talk with a doctorate student over the summer, and we discussed briefly the call of a person to be in community with God the Trinity, and with vast "Cloud of Witnesses". Along with that conversation I have been thinking about the church in terms of community. What if the richer provieded what the poorer church family needed? what if we took waht we needed and gave it to the rest of God's people? Is this biblical? THere is also so much lonliness in the church, part of it is that we never let anyone know who we are because we are afraid to be found out as frauds, liars, hypocrits, or even worse real (instead of hypothetical) sinners. The call to community, is a call to family, a call to reconcilation, a call to care. What if God's people lived in community?
Amen! It's so hard though. We're so afraid of judgment and condemnation. I have sin in my life that I would have trouble fessing up to, I'm afraid and ashamed of it. But somebodie's going to have to have the courage to believe that there really is no condemnation for those who are in Christ. That fear holds me back. If we could just see that we're all in the same struggle, but that even still God loves us. I think that our self-righteouness would be gone. In most ways, collectively as a church we begin to act self-righteously toward the world and those around us, and we alienate ourselves from our neighbors instead of reconciling. Deep beneath all that is fear of judgment and death, which the Gospel of Jesus Christ goes right at.
I think that all this talk has to find action. If we really believe the gospel, we are obligated to live it. I like to talk about it, but when it comes to doing it, I am lazy, selfish, and afraid.
I like what you say about rich congregations giving to poorer ones. We seem to focus so much on evangelism and missions, we forget about our own. The body of Christ must be built up if it is to be strong.
I agree with Eric. All this talk does need to find action and sometimes I think that's a problem. We like to sit around and discuss issues, but we don't like to address them, or even admit them as our issues, in person.
How do you build an open and honest community like this within the church that's already established? It's obviously not safe to go against the grain... we might encounter opposition or even worse: get thrown out of the church!
So how are we going to act brothers? There's no condemnation in Christ, unforunately, there's condemnation in humanity.
What are we going to do when we go to church on Sunday? Sit back? Dwell only on what we've talked about? Are we Christian pansies?
This is all very powerful stuff my friends. Sorry I have'nt posted on this one yet. I can't help but make the correlation between the nation of Israel and the Church of the New Covenant. Israel was elected by God, for what? It was to be his voice to all the nations. So are we called, elected to be the work of Christ to the ends of the earth. How powerful and enriching idea is that, that we have the priveledge to take part in God's reconciling work to the world. Bonhoeffer is rich here, he goes as far to say that the Church is the very presence of Christ in the world (im probably butchering his words), not as another Christ, but the same one that died and rose. In short, I believe that the community of believers in Christ has a purpose. We understand and know the reconciliation of the world through Christ, and now it is our privledge to share that truth with the rest of the world; in the Church, which Christ helms, the world will move towards the realization of it's salvation in Christ. With that we are unified because of our relationship with God in Christ. This unity is what makes the Orthodox teen in Russia able to relate and uplift the Baptist teen in Kansas if they were to meet. The community that we share as a Church is indeed unique, we testify the salvation of man...or at least we should. The question comes again to, does the Church actually believe it.
In regards to the practical, this is a tough question. What good is a robust theology of the Church if we cannot live it. How does it translate to Sunday mornings? I too believe there will be opposition as this type of relational attitude isnt as comfortable as legalism or as passive as diehard liberalism, it is something altogether different...relational...i dont have an answer though.
WOW! Bless you all for your many thoughts and honesty. I desperatley needed others to tackle this issue with me. Bless you!
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THat being said, EJ said some powerful things, lies that I still hold onto. What if we confessed our sin, I mean our deepest darkest sin? I believe that we would begin on the road to healing! I have not yet found the community to do this with because I too am afraid! I fail to believe the Gospel! Maybe the greatest thing that could happen to us, is that our sins would be exposed on the 5 o clock news, I mean the really bad stuff, that we could be seen for what we are, get beyond the facade. Because the truth is that Jesus already knows our sins, and still we stand redeemed, forgiven, justified, and as holy as we will ever be!
I believe that this fear of being exposed, has made all of us very good sin managers!I believe all this does is behavior modification. Until we can confess and admit to who we really are, Jesus will be a hypothetical savior for me a hypothetical sinner. But if we can confess with boldness our sin, I believe we will learn how great our savior is! Jesus wishes to transform us, to make us like him, and he believes that we can actually be like him!
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To the questions of practicality, is there a way to meet at least once a month to practice authentic community, confession, prayer, and service? If we could collectively move to action, learn how to live this together for ourselves, we may be able guide others later. We cannot go where we have not yet been!
Blessings JJ
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